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> Returning Barn Find BB To The Road
DBF
post Jan 3 2022, 08:00 PM
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I posted earlier about finding this survivor BB and I am working to get it back on the road by spring. I was asked to post more photos, and I’d also appreciate some advice on a couple items.

The first regards the engine. The car has 100K miles, and my experience with VW Type 1 motors is they are ready for a rebuild, at least a top-end rebuild at 100K. Is that true for Type 4's as well? I have the engine stripped down to the bare case/cylinders/heads since I want to clean off 100K worth of old oil/dirt, replace all the oil seals (yes all leaked), and to replace the fuel injection/air intake seals and vacuum lines to help ensure good drivability. Does the mileage say it’s time to keep taking it apart?

The second regards the fuel pump. It is still in the rear of course, but I plan to pull the gas tank to replace the old fuel lines, including installing stainless steel lines. “While I’m at it”, should I move the fuel pump to the front? It changes the originality of the car, but I plan to autocross and attend DE events with the car, so looking for safety and reliability.

Here is the car on the lift a friend gave me when he closed his auto repair shop this fall. It is a tight fit, but works for my small cars and old jeeps. I was sweating as the lift was being installed, hoping that all my calculations were correct, and was relieved when the 914 fit as planned. I was so anxious to see if it would fit that we lifted the 914 before we cleaned up the garage after the install. It will also allow me to store two small cars. Lastly, while on the lift I can still open and close the 914’s doors with one finger.


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iankarr
post Jan 4 2022, 04:34 PM
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As I mentioned on your welcome thread, I've just restored my bumblebee and am happy to help in any way. It seems you've got a much more complete head-start on yours.

Happy to give you my take on your questions, but fair warning...some of my answers are heavily influenced by the fact that you found a unicorn BB. I know you mentioned that it's had a repaint, but other than that...as they say...it's only original once.

Engine:
100K isn't really a magic number for a rebuild. A lot depends on what you know about the car, and where you're at with the motor. Did the previous owner provide any documetation or service records? How sure are you about the mileage? How do the pistons/cylinders/rings look? (Please post pics) Did the guy you bought it from ever ride in the car / hear it run? Personally, if someone can vouch that the engine ran well before parked (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif), the pistons look good and the cylinders don't have any scoring, I'd be inclined to just re-ring the pistons, hone the cylinders, have the heads checked and do a top-end refresh. You can also inspect the rods and crank for anything major by looking into the open registers. The quality of OEM parts is generally better than what's available today, and originality is important with an LE. The less history you have on the engine and the more worn the parts are, the more a full rebuild makes sense.

Fuel Lines:
The SS ones are great and it's generally advisible to swap out the 50 year old vinyl (?) fuel lines. There have been stories of those leaking and catching fire. That said, I've changed them out on several cars and in every case they were intact and still pliable. If originality is important and you don't smell gas in the cabin, the original lines may be okay for a while longer.

Fuel Pump:
I've owned two 914s with the pump in the stock location and never experienced vapor lock while driving (northeast and west coast). It's a documented issue and the factory obviously moved the pump up front for a reason, but since you're not in a typically hot location, I'd drive it for a while and see how things go. More likely will be that the fuel pump will leak. If that happens you can have it rebuilt, or go with a modern, two-port unit.

You're at the beginning of a fantastic journey, putting a rare vehicle back on the road. You'll find that this is an awesome community that's incredibly generous with their knowledge, so post often. Just be sure to include lots of pictures!

Be safe and enjoy!

Ian
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Chaznaster
post Jan 4 2022, 06:07 PM
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QUOTE(DBF @ Jan 3 2022, 09:00 PM) *

I posted earlier about finding this survivor BB and I am working to get it back on the road by spring. I was asked to post more photos, and I’d also appreciate some advice on a couple items.

The first regards the engine. The car has 100K miles, and my experience with VW Type 1 motors is they are ready for a rebuild, at least a top-end rebuild at 100K. Is that true for Type 4's as well? I have the engine stripped down to the bare case/cylinders/heads since I want to clean off 100K worth of old oil/dirt, replace all the oil seals (yes all leaked), and to replace the fuel injection/air intake seals and vacuum lines to help ensure good drivability. Does the mileage say it’s time to keep taking it apart?

The second regards the fuel pump. It is still in the rear of course, but I plan to pull the gas tank to replace the old fuel lines, including installing stainless steel lines. “While I’m at it”, should I move the fuel pump to the front? It changes the originality of the car, but I plan to autocross and attend DE events with the car, so looking for safety and reliability.

Here is the car on the lift a friend gave me when he closed his auto repair shop this fall. It is a tight fit, but works for my small cars and old jeeps. I was sweating as the lift was being installed, hoping that all my calculations were correct, and was relieved when the 914 fit as planned. I was so anxious to see if it would fit that we lifted the 914 before we cleaned up the garage after the install. It will also allow me to store two small cars. Lastly, while on the lift I can still open and close the 914’s doors with one finger.


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Love the cutouts in the ceiling to get the lift to fit! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
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Cairo94507
post Jan 4 2022, 06:25 PM
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I think Ian nailed it for your car. Of course.....more photos needed for our entertainment. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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ddire333
post Jan 5 2022, 07:46 AM
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Welcome, looks like a very good example. I had a lot more work to do on mine so moved the fuel pump up front when re-doing the fuel lines and tank was out, "as I was in here", It did add quite a bit of time just getting the lines right as you have size (diameter) differences from the tank feed, to the filter, to the pump to deal with.
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DBF
post Jan 7 2022, 10:57 AM
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Thanks for the great advice. Ian - if you're reading this - your advice and the videos are great and will be very useful as I get the car back on the road. I especially appreciate the comments about "only original once". I am lucky to own and co-own a number of old unrestored VW's, one of the first 996's imported to the U.S., and a WWII Jeep that were bought from the original owners. We keep them as original as possible while making them reliable drivers, and that is sage advice for the BB.

My original plan for a 914 was to find a relatively un-rusted example and upgrade the brakes and suspension for autocross and DE events. As luck would have it, I found yet another survivor, and even luckier since it is a BB, so I now have another car to keep as original as possible. I admit I was wrestling with the idea of installing stainless steel fuel lines, and after hearing Ian's comments, and I also talked with Brad Mayeur from 914 Limited who said he has never seen the original vinyl tubes leak, I will stick with the originals. I feel a lot better about this since I looked closer at the interior and it doesn't look like any pieces were ever removed. It looks like you need access to the tunnel in order to install stainless steel lines, and my experience with car interiors is it is almost impossible to remove and re-install interior pieces and get them exactly the same as when the factory technician put them in the car. There are usually tell-tale marks when pieces are removed (marred fasteners, old creases showing where the piece originally was set in the car, new marks on the vinyl), and there are none of these in this car’s interior.

Here are a few more photos of the car, including when I first picked it up with 20 years of dust, and the serial number of the front spoiler. Interesting it has the VW logo, and I am hearing this is a very rare part.

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BK911
post Jan 8 2022, 07:14 AM
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QUOTE


Love the cutouts in the ceiling to get the lift to fit! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)


Code requires sheet rock ceiling in garage if occupied space above.
Doubt anybody except a keyboard commando will say anything.
But there is a reason for this requirement.
Make sure smoke detectors are functional!!!
/rant

Love the project. Looks like you found a nice car which will be worth the effort.
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Cracker
post Jan 8 2022, 07:31 AM
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Congratulations again on such a fantastic find ~ I am happy for you! I think you definitely need a sign "Parking of Porsche's Only" on the wall! Love the lift idea ~ I've never seen one installed through the trusses like that before ~ creative!

As others have said - it looks like you have a GREAT head start on nearly most projects that are taken on here on the World. Take your time, think before you act and as someone told me yesterday, "don't f - - k it up. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

Cracker

BTW: Do you have a limit switch on your lift??? (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif)
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Freezin 914
post Jan 8 2022, 07:33 AM
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QUOTE(BK911 @ Jan 8 2022, 07:14 AM) *

QUOTE


Love the cutouts in the ceiling to get the lift to fit! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)


Code requires sheet rock ceiling in garage if occupied space above.
Doubt anybody except a keyboard commando will say anything.
But there is a reason for this requirement.
Make sure smoke detectors are functional!!!
/rant

Love the project. Looks like you found a nice car which will be worth the effort.


Code would also require drywall/ Sheetrock to be on ceiling and common house walls. Would also have to have tape and mud if the garage is attached. If a fire broke out in the garage, you would want to stop it from spreading easily to attic space.

Now, enough of all the code stuff (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) ….. let’s see more of this car!!!
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mb911
post Jan 8 2022, 09:20 AM
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Please tell me your kidding about leaving the original fuel lines in the car?

The stainless ones are so nice and so easy to put in.

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Freezin 914
post Jan 8 2022, 12:10 PM
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QUOTE(mb911 @ Jan 8 2022, 09:20 AM) *

Please tell me your kidding about leaving the original fuel lines in the car?

The stainless ones are so nice and so easy to put in.


(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) I completely understand as original as possible. There is something about the piece of mind alone. I’m sure there is a dozen or more members here that could tell you a few horror stories of their cars on fire on the side of the road watching them burn down.
I am with Ben, please at least think about it. I would be a shame if something bad happened to either you or the car.
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JeffBowlsby
post Jan 8 2022, 12:16 PM
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QUOTE(DBF @ Jan 7 2022, 08:57 AM) *

...the serial number of the front spoiler. Interesting it has the VW logo, and I am hearing this is a very rare part.

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Rare is an understatement. This LE spoiler design was developed specifically for the 914 Can Am cars, although it was subsequently a factory-installed optional equipment item for later model 914s and sold through dealership parts counters to all 914 owners. It has been reproduced by many becasue of its desireable design, although none are quite like the original. Of the 291 914 CanAm cars on the Regsitry, over 200 of their owners would give their right arm for the chance to own this spoiler. It is irreplaceable at this point as there are no more in factory production.
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mb911
post Jan 8 2022, 12:57 PM
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Here is an example of original fuel lines. This car was incredibly taken care of with tons and tons of maintenance records. Attached Image

I almost have it back together after buying this basket case.
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JeffBowlsby
post Jan 8 2022, 01:15 PM
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QUOTE(mb911 @ Jan 8 2022, 10:57 AM) *

Here is an example of original fuel lines. This car was incredibly taken care of with tons and tons of maintenance records.

I almost have it back together after buying this basket case.


The 928 fuel line situation is similar but different than the 914. But your point is well made that both cars are known to burn with fuel leakage from defective or worn out fuel lines.

Similar in that both cars rely on rubber soft fuel lines and clamped connections on top of the engine. Different in that the main fuel supply/return lines on the 928 are metal not nylon, and the two primary flex lines are located in very close proximity to the passenger side head.
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mb911
post Jan 8 2022, 01:19 PM
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QUOTE(JeffBowlsby @ Jan 8 2022, 11:15 AM) *

QUOTE(mb911 @ Jan 8 2022, 10:57 AM) *

Here is an example of original fuel lines. This car was incredibly taken care of with tons and tons of maintenance records.

I almost have it back together after buying this basket case.


The 928 fuel line situation is similar but different than the 914. But your point is well made that both cars are known to burn with fuel leakage from defective or worn out fuel lines.

Similar in that both cars rely on rubber soft fuel lines and clamped connections on top of the engine. Different in that the main fuel supply/return lines on the 928 are metal not nylon, and the two primary flex lines are located in very close proximity to the passenger side head.



I agree.. just wanted to make a point. Hate to see any car start on fire. They don't make these anymore
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DBF
post Jan 9 2022, 04:00 PM
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Thanks for the concerns about my garage. I'm within code requirements. There is only one common wall between the house and garage, and they don't share a common attic. We have two 1/2 fire rated drywall between the house and garage. I also have an emergency cable stop for the lift, and it is attached to the pump motor right next to the button that raises the lift so can also be used as an emergency stop if the button sticks.

I was inspired by Cracker's photos of the original owner of his 68 911. Here's me with my '66 VW in 1974, and with the 914 when I picked it up. I think the 914 has weathered the years better than me!

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DBF
post Jan 9 2022, 04:20 PM
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I looked closer at the fuel lines in the engine compartment and they don't have any flex anymore. I also wonder if this is the original fuel pump? It has a single inlet and outlet - I thought I read that 914's had two outlets??

The brakes will need some work. The master leaked all the brake fluid and is solid rust, so I bought an easy install 19mm from 914Rubber. The parking brake works fine, but we'll see how the hydraulic system works when I install the master cylinder. The front brakes certainly look like they'll need some refurbishment.

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Cracker
post Jan 9 2022, 04:47 PM
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I'll be the first to say it...oh my, your chassis looks to be AMAZING! You certainly know this already but damn! This find just gets better and better...

Photo's look great - you as well... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Cracker
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iankarr
post Jan 9 2022, 05:06 PM
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Agreed. Looking great.

Yeah, probably time for the SS fuel lines and a new pump.
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mepstein
post Jan 9 2022, 05:33 PM
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QUOTE(iankarr @ Jan 9 2022, 06:06 PM) *

Agreed. Looking great.

Yeah, probably time for the SS fuel lines and a new pump.

And caliper soft lines.
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