Oil pressure relief valve plug- I have a leak after installing Tangerine piston etc, Can we use one of these plugs? I can’t get the stock one tight |
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Oil pressure relief valve plug- I have a leak after installing Tangerine piston etc, Can we use one of these plugs? I can’t get the stock one tight |
DRPHIL914 |
Jan 18 2020, 10:42 AM
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#1
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
This has been in car for over a year but while under the car doing the shift rod and bushing, noticed I have a leak- looks to be from this location, and I cannot get it tighter, and that slot in the plug is horrible design. I am wondering if we can use one of these other plugs with a hex head on it?? And FYI it’s not the stock plunger and spring it’s the Tangerine one.
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ChrisFoley |
Jan 18 2020, 11:18 AM
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#2
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I am Tangerine Racing Group: Members Posts: 7,894 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Bolton, CT Member No.: 209 Region Association: None |
The only way you can use a different retaining screw is if it's length from the gasket surface to the internal contact surface is precisely the same as the oem piece.
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DRPHIL914 |
Jan 18 2020, 11:22 AM
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#3
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
The only way you can use a different retaining screw is if it's length from the gasket surface to the internal contact surface is precisely the same as the oem piece. That’s what I figured, so do you know if there is a 914 plug That has the hex head not a slot? Or do I have a different issue with the fit of the new pressure valve if I can’t get it tighter? |
iankarr |
Jan 18 2020, 11:27 AM
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#4
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The wrencher formerly known as Cuddy_K Group: Members Posts: 2,469 Joined: 22-May 15 From: Heber City, UT Member No.: 18,749 Region Association: Intermountain Region |
What kind of crush washer are you using?
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framos914 |
May 18 2020, 04:54 PM
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 125 Joined: 15-May 14 From: Corona California Member No.: 17,353 Region Association: Southern California |
What kind of crush washer are you using? I have the same issue. Leaking and hard to properly tighten the plug due to having a large slot slot and can't get a good grip. I believe my crush washer is aluminum. What kind should I be using? Have tried twice to fix the leak. Would Teflon tape help? |
Amphicar770 |
May 18 2020, 05:41 PM
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#6
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 1,181 Joined: 20-April 10 From: PA, USA Member No.: 11,639 Region Association: MidAtlantic Region |
What kind of crush washer are you using? I have the same issue. Leaking and hard to properly tighten the plug due to having a large slot slot and can't get a good grip. I believe my crush washer is aluminum. What kind should I be using? Have tried twice to fix the leak. Would Teflon tape help? Not sure about Teflon tape but I have used Teflon paste in other leaky threads with good result. I have the Tangerine relief valve although still not sure if it is intended for drivers rather than track teeners. In any event, I used a bonded aluminum crush washer and have no leaks. |
HAM Inc |
May 18 2020, 06:01 PM
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#7
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 846 Joined: 24-July 06 From: Watkinsville,GA Member No.: 6,499 Region Association: None |
I used to weld a M8 Nut to the bottom of my plugs so I could use a socket instead of a screwdriver.
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iankarr |
May 18 2020, 07:15 PM
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#8
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The wrencher formerly known as Cuddy_K Group: Members Posts: 2,469 Joined: 22-May 15 From: Heber City, UT Member No.: 18,749 Region Association: Intermountain Region |
Have you tried putting a small chisel in the slot and tapping it with a hammer (clockwise) so the plug tightens a bit more?
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cary |
May 18 2020, 10:43 PM
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#9
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,900 Joined: 26-January 04 From: Sherwood Oregon Member No.: 1,608 Region Association: Pacific Northwest |
I used to weld a M8 Nut to the bottom of my plugs so I could use a socket instead of a screwdriver. I like it ........... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/piratenanner.gif) |
HAM Inc |
May 19 2020, 05:44 AM
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#10
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 846 Joined: 24-July 06 From: Watkinsville,GA Member No.: 6,499 Region Association: None |
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Olympic 914 |
May 19 2020, 07:12 AM
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#11
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Group: Members Posts: 1,658 Joined: 7-July 11 From: Pittsburgh PA Member No.: 13,287 Region Association: North East States |
Going back to the part the Dr. Phil showed, How hard would it really be to measure the original part and match the new part to it. ??
If it was long enough. |
02loftsmoor |
May 19 2020, 07:18 AM
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#12
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 577 Joined: 26-June 11 From: Ft. Worth TX Member No.: 13,243 Region Association: Southwest Region |
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Mblizzard |
May 19 2020, 08:18 AM
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#13
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Advanced Member Group: Members Posts: 3,033 Joined: 28-January 13 From: Knoxville Tn Member No.: 15,438 Region Association: South East States |
Drag link and new crush washer typically so
Vet the problem. |
02loftsmoor |
May 19 2020, 09:14 AM
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#14
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Senior Member Group: Members Posts: 577 Joined: 26-June 11 From: Ft. Worth TX Member No.: 13,243 Region Association: Southwest Region |
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DRPHIL914 |
May 21 2020, 05:32 AM
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#15
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
I used to weld a M8 Nut to the bottom of my plugs so I could use a socket instead of a screwdriver. It just dawned on me I actually used M10 nuts, not M8. great idea, i’d have to have someone else do that for me, i don’t currently have access to a welder Going back to the part the Dr. Phil showed, How hard would it really be to measure the original part and match the new part to it. ?? If it was long enough. So i went ahead and bought a couple of these that have hex head one was a Porsche part , other came from 356Devotion, but thread specs are the same as ours. i wanted to check and measure these to compare to stock. as Chris says it better be the same depth on the inside other wise the piston will either not be held up in correct position or this plug will not be able to make it up into place. i think it can be measured with a proper tool. i borrowed one from a friend and i will take some pics of it here and post this today. now, it turns out the oil leaking along this location was all coming from above this, at my aux oil cooler adapter plate!! this had become loose and i had not checked it or made sure it was secure and torqued correctly on the last filter and oil change SO this weekend i did oil change along with transmission service and found this to be bet loose and now it’s tight and no leaks!!! so it was a false alarm on the plug leak but that’s fine still need to look at this further |
DRPHIL914 |
May 21 2020, 06:22 AM
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#16
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
a couple things to consider and a load of infor if you want to read up on this, i found this on Pelican Parts website-
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-...lve-thread.html it looks like on the 911 the factory changes to the hex head plug and changed the depth of it from 12mm to 9mm and changed the spring to increase oil pressure, then later made mods like drilling etc- read the article, i am not getting into that now but also they discuss and show that in the later 944’s they made a part that replace the traditional spring and plunger, and this looks just like the Tangering racing mod that i have installed , so Chis can chime in but i wonder if he got the idea to do this from the 944 or maybe just great engineering minds think alike, as it seems to be a natural or logical thought process and conclusion to come to. at any rate if you add the thickness of a crush washer @1.5mm, and stayed with a stock spring i think you could use this new plug that has the 9mm depth, but i guess someone here that has an actual pressure gauge could do this and report back? Chris can correct me if i am wrong but the Tangerine mod with the plunger would probably not allow the plug to seal due to the 3mm depth difference, not without modification to the plunger length. i suppose a brave soul could take off 3mm from the bottom of the TR plunger? would this then fit. these are listed part numbers for 911 in the article but appear to be same as ours, the hex head plug part number ends in 999-064-026-02, the early plug is 999-064-010-02 Phil Attached thumbnail(s) |
ChrisFoley |
May 21 2020, 06:48 AM
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#17
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I am Tangerine Racing Group: Members Posts: 7,894 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Bolton, CT Member No.: 209 Region Association: None |
Phil,
my product is 100% my idea and follows a different concept. The steel sleeve I use eliminates the issue of case wear from years of having the piston/spring move up and down as the engine rpm changes. My sleeve has an o-ring at the top for sealing and a screw near the bottom retains the spring/piston inside. There is no way the precisely machined length can be altered more than a few thousandths to accommodate a different length screw cap. |
DRPHIL914 |
May 21 2020, 07:23 AM
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#18
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
Phil, my product is 100% my idea and follows a different concept. The steel sleeve I use eliminates the issue of case wear from years of having the piston/spring move up and down as the engine rpm changes. My sleeve has an o-ring at the top for sealing and a screw near the bottom retains the spring/piston inside. There is no way the precisely machined length can be altered more than a few thousandths to accommodate a different length screw cap. yes i know ours was from wear, this one on the 944 is similar but for a different reason, not due to wear but to control pressure better, but it is a sleeve with an o-ring at the end and an internal spring- either way needed to know if you thought we could modify yours to fit the plug with is 3mm less deep inside the rest is the same, so it would never seat without making the piston shorter. and not necessary anyway at this point not for me . but maybe in future production you could take this into account and make one that would work with the hex head plug. that’s all i was saying. would probably work fine for stock spring. or one could take and mill 3mm out of the inside of the hex plug to make its internal dimension match up with the 12mm depth of a stock one. my leak was the adapter for the aux oil cooler we installed when i had my car up there and i didn’t notice it was loose until this current oil change. Attached thumbnail(s) |
DRPHIL914 |
May 21 2020, 07:30 AM
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#19
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Dr. Phil Group: Members Posts: 5,753 Joined: 9-December 09 From: Bluffton, SC Member No.: 11,106 Region Association: South East States |
here are some pics of the 2 plugs, from different angles, you can see the new style hex
plug is not as deep inside so it’s going to compress a spring by 3mm more, and for the plunger style conversion it would not work you would not get it screwed in, you’d have to use a 3mm thinker crush washer or mill out the inside to accept the length of the Tangerine plunger. i did verify and measure with this caliper and the new plug depth is 9.13mm and the stock one is 12.53 fyi Attached thumbnail(s) |
ChrisFoley |
May 21 2020, 07:52 AM
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#20
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I am Tangerine Racing Group: Members Posts: 7,894 Joined: 29-January 03 From: Bolton, CT Member No.: 209 Region Association: None |
A direct comparison with the 914 plug would be more valuable.
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